Tuesday, January 19, 2010

In Roman times did people get nailed to a Cross or a Stake?

Please reference material like encyclopedias, dictionaries, history books, etc. will be better rather than personal opinion..In Roman times did people get nailed to a Cross or a Stake?
Both. A cross IS a stake; it just has a crosspiece added to it.





Seneca wrote in the first century that that he saw ';three crosses (Gr stauros, Latin crux) , not indeed of one sort, but fashioned in different ways; one sort suspending by the head....others transfixing them through their secret parts; others extending their arms on a patibulum.';....Consol Ad Marciam xx





'; The men ordered to lead the slave to his punishment, having stretched out both his arms and fastened them to a piece of wood which extended across his breast and shoulders as far as his wrists, followed him, tearing his naked body with whips.';-- Dionysius of Halacarnassus, written around 7 BC





I think it's better to quote someone who actually lived at that time than to quote dictionaries or references that have been written by people who are just stating their own conclusions. Why not go straight to the source?In Roman times did people get nailed to a Cross or a Stake?
In ancient inscriptions it is a cross.
Here are some reference material that you want rather than personal material...





Granted this is material that I researched myself, if this offends you, I apologize but I am just giving what is being explained in encyclopedias and other available literature...





In ';The Imperial Bible-Dictionary'; Vol.1, pg. 376 :





The Greek work for cross, (staorus), properly signified a stake, an upright pole, or piece of pailing, on which anything might be hung, or which might be used in impaling (fencing in) a piece of ground. Even amongst the Romans the 'crux' (from which our 'cross' is derived) appears to have been originally an upright pole.';





In the ';Greek-English Lexicon'; by Liddell and Scott mention:


';Wood cut and ready for use, firewood, timber, etc...piece of wood, log, beam, post...cudgel, club...stake on which criminals were impaled...of live wood, tree.';





In the Bible in these following translations the King James, Revised Standard Version, The Jerusalem Bible, and The Catholic Challoner-Douay Version...





In the above translations in Acts 5:30 and 10:39 mention the word 'tree'...from the Greek word stauros





Lastly in the book ';The Non-Christian Cross'; by J. D. Parsons says: ';There is not a single sentence in any of the numerous writings forming the New Testement, which, in the original Greek, bears even indirect evidence to the effect that the stauros used in the case of Jesus was other than an ordinary stauros; much less to the effect that it consisted, not of one piece of timber, but of two pieces nailed together in the form of a cross...It is not a little misleading upon the part of our teachers to translate the word stauros as 'cross' in our Lexicons as the meaning of stauros without carefully explaining that that was at any rate not the primary meaning of the word in the days of the Apostles, did not become its primary signification till long afterwards, and became so then, if at all, only because, despite the absence of corroboratice evidence, it was for some reason or other assumed that the particular stauros upon which Jesus was executed had that particular shape.';





So ther are some reference material that I am sure you will enjoy as much as I did and so please I suggest that you look for the books and read the information for yourself so that you yourself may be enlightened to how things really were back then....





Peace
The Romans never nailed anyone to a stake, ever, no matter what the Watchtower Society may have told you.
Ok, if you look in one of the gospels, Luke I believe. It mentions that while Jesus hung on the cross, there was a sign placed above his head reading - The king of the Jews, written in 3 languages. The point of this is that Jesus was crucified on a cross, had he been nailed to a stake, the bible wouldn't be correct in saying this sign was nailed above his head. If Jesus was nailed to a stake , this sign would be above both his head and hands, unless you can get the sign posted between his head and hands. I'm not sure of the exact scripture in the gospel, but it clearly reads that this sign was nailed only above his head... Jesus was put to death on a cross. Does this make sense. Am I explicit enough? Hope I'm clear.
What difference does it make? They were dead either way!
Crucifixion was the Roman's favorite mode of execution.


For more info:


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crucifixion
Rome and its power and its barbarism were around for more than a few centuries, as you know, but out in the boonies, where Jesus meandered about preaching for three years, punishment crossed the spectrum: a criminal (to which crucifixion was reserved) would be either nailed or roped to a pole with a 'cross.' Other victims were hanged, burned alive, stabbed, poisoned, fed to beasts, drowned, tortured to death, beat to death--Rome was inventive. The story told is that Jesus was tortured and then nailed to a pole, the nails going into the center of his palms and not into his wrists. Death would have come slowly, ever so slowly. Crawling things, especially ants, would surely come to feast. No water, no food. And finally, after probably three days and three nights, mercifully death. Hundreds of thousands were so executed during the Roman occupation. Jesus was only one of the thousands and to the Romans of no consequence. Rome was really good at its record keeping. Jesus is nowhere mentioned, though many others were. Perhaps those pages were lost.
I will point out two things.


1.Nails were Iron. Iron was a precious metal. In the first century the Romans were still using Bronze for a lot of their armour and weapons because Iron was simply too scarce and expensive.


2. The Romans had no claw hammers to pull nails back out with.





It is also a fact that the Roman Army had a system for setting up a palisade around their camps. They made each man bring two pre notched stakes (sudes) with him that fitted together to make an X shaped cross and that is what they crucified criminals on. Criminals were lashed to them with cordage. These sudes lashed together quickly and everything was reusable.


The Romans were notable for using economical methods. Iron nails would have been to valuable to waste on killing prisoners and would have wrecked the sudes as well.





I would also direct you to look at the point that most of the crucifiction scenes were painted hundreds of years later.


If you look at the ones showing a tall cross they show men on ladders carrying or holding Jesus in position as they nail him to the cross.


Try to picture this in your mind.


I doubt if any soldier would risk getting knocked off of a ladder killing a convict.


It is just too inefficient of a technique. Working from a ladder is hard enough without dealing with a struggling criminal who knows he has nothing to lose and who would count a quick death as better than what is about to happen.
Jesus was nailed to a cross.





Look it up yourself.

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